w/ a fellow podcaster Kyle (of What Kind of Asian Are You?) 🍜🇭🇰🥢 on the inner world of an introvert + asking: how to make big decisions? (010)
Co-Host: Kyle Leung (host of @whatkindofasianpod) | Host: Xinyi Xan @xinyixan
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Hi! I can't believe that we're already at episode 10 of Don't Be Strangers!
I'm XinYi, and I started this series of collaborative conversations to learn from friends and strangers alike for how to create agency in your life and deepen your connections with everyone you meet. Before we jump into the meat of the topic, I want to remind you that early sign ups for the Pen Pal community that I'm trying to build is still open and you can find the link to sign up on the instagram page @dontbestrangers. I'm extremely stoked for this community because it'll allow the listeners (AKA you) to directly connect with past co-hosts as well as with each other!
Each month you'll be sent a prompt inspired by questions from the podcast which you will answer and send to someone else within the club. This club will be a whole-community experience because instead of mutual 1-1 pairings, everyone will be ordered in a circle so you'll feel part of the bigger whole... who you send to will be different from who you receive from! Every month, get connected to 2 new friends. And because I'm providing the the prompt which you know you already find interesting (because you listen to this podcast), you can skip the small talk and dive straight into the deep stuff... Again, if I've piqued your interest, you can find the details for signing up on the @dontbestrangers instagram page.
With that out of the way... today I'm chatting with a fellow podcaster named Kyle who runs What Kind of Asian Podcast, a podcast series dedicated to exploring and telling the stories of the Asian diaspora. He's been running his passion project for over a year with over 50 episodes out, and I am so honored that he lended me some of his time so that we can bring you this episode!
Through a single conversation with Kyle, my first impressions of him are that he's extremely thoughtful, expressed in both the way he asks questions as well as the way he perceives his introspectiveness. Highlights of this conversation includes... (1) activities that we do that makes us feel most authentically ourselves, (2) the inner world of an introvert, (3) my happiest memory with my family, (4) Kyle's strategy for making big decisions in life without over-worrying, and (5) the real reason behind his decision to move to Toronto. So this is Kyle!
Timestamps
04:16 - Q1 Kyle to Xinyi: What is one activity that you would do that makes you feel like you are the most authentic you when you are doing it?
06:34 - Q Kyle to Xinyi: Why do you think being childish is the most real for yourself?
06:47 - Xinyi: Childhood is authentic because it's the time in your life before you become molded into society, other people's expectations of you, etc... at that point in time... you lived more independently of all these thoughts.
07:17 - Q Xinyi to Kyle: What activities make you feel like you are the most authentic you when you are doing it?
12:50 - Q Xinyi to Kyle: As an introvert (and podcast interviewer), do you ever maintain conversations post episode recording?
14:33 - Kyle: I want to be part of the platform or person to help other people get where they want to get to. I don't care to be the center of attention but I want other people who does want that center of attention to get the attention that they need.
14:56 - Q Kyle to Xinyi: What is your happiest memory that you had with your family/family members and what makes it so happy for you?
17:57 - Kyle: I think a lot of people have a certain expectation of what makes me happy... sometimes you might not meet those kind of criteria... but then it doesn't it mean it shouldn't be a happy thing.
19:47 - Kyle: I really am a believer that you just have to let things happen and when it happens it happens. And of course you should be responsible and plan things out that you need to do that are important... but you shouldn't put that much emphasis — "oh I need to have a plan, I need to follow through"... because that's a lot of pressure. Sometimes things are beyond your control in the future that could ruin your plans. But at that point, you just need to keep going at what you're doing or change your path.
20:26 - Kyle's answer to: How do you decide what you want to do?
20:38 - Kyle: My question is, "Are you willing to take a leap of faith?" You just have to make the best choice based on what you know at that point. You can't keep thinking, "Oh, but there's so many unknown variables." You're always going to be like, "I don't know what's going to happen, I can't make a choice."
21:51 - Q Xinyi to Kyle: How did you end up teaching in Taiwan for 3 years?
24:17 - Other people and what they do are not the same as yours, and that's ok. You don't have to be on the same timeline as them.
25:41 - After a few years I realized I was just afraid. It's not that I don't have those ambitions of getting into the next position... but now I feel like I'm ready, I'm willing to put in the work.
26:34 - Q Kyle to Xinyi: What is failure to you and what is your way of overcoming your failures? 30:50 - Xinyi: I think it’s just persistence. You acknowledge that the problem is important to you, and then you just keep trying different solutions.
31:26 - Q Kyle to Xinyi: What do you think is the true reason behind you not being able to reply [to friends]?
34:54 - Miscommunication thru text example with Abbas (w/ creative chimera storyteller Abhas 🦎🇮🇳🏝 on life-changing solo trips + asking: how to reframe anxiety as excitement?) 36:56 - Q Xinyi to Kyle: Before you arrived at creating your podcast, what other long-term/big projects have you tried but eventually lost interest or had to put them aside?
37:28 - Kyle: At the beginning of creating...
Nobody tells this to people who are beginners, and I really wish somebody had told this to me.
All of us who do creative work, we get into it because we have good taste. But it's like there is this gap. For the first couple years that you're making stuff, what you're making isn't so good. It’s not that great. It’s trying to be good, it has ambition to be good, but it’s not that good.
But your taste, the thing that got you into the game, is still killer. And your taste is good enough that you can tell that what you're making is kind of a disappointment to you. A lot of people never get past that phase. They quit.
Everybody I know who does interesting, creative work they went through years where they had really good taste and they could tell that what they were making wasn't as good as they wanted it to be. They knew it fell short. Everybody goes through that.
And if you are just starting out or if you are still in this phase, you gotta know its normal and the most important thing you can do is do a lot of work. Do a huge volume of work. Put yourself on a deadline so that every week or every month you know you're going to finish one story. It is only by going through a volume of work that you're going to catch up and close that gap. And the work you're making will be as good as your ambitions.
I took longer to figure out how to do this than anyone I’ve ever met. It takes awhile. It’s gonna take you a while. It’s normal to take a while. You just have to fight your way through that.
—Ira Glass
39:39 - Q Xinyi to Kyle: Where do you envision your podcast going? Or what are you trying to practice or improve towards?
42:13 - Q Kyle to Xinyi: If you are able to do one thing for the world that can change/impact the world in a positive way that you may not get recognition for, what would you want that thing to be?
46:06 - Q Xinyi to Kyle: How do you define a stranger and at what point do they go from being one to not being one?
48:06 - Kyle: In order for someone to be a close friend, it'd be where I'm giving away really intimate, deep stuff about myself, unprompted.
48:42 - Surprise! 🎉 🥳 🎉
And that's a wrap! I hope you enjoyed this conversation as much as I enjoyed recording it. I confess that anytime I have to speak with an actual stranger for one of these recordings, I get really nervous. And by the end of the conversation my brain is on fire... similar to the feeling I used to get in college after a really intense exam. I think it's because it requires so much focus to details to what is happening during the conversation... but in any case, I love it, and that's why I'm still doing it!
You can check out Kyle's podcast @whatkindofasianpod on instagram. If you're a fellow Asian who grew up in non-Asian context, you'll probably find these vignettes extremely inspiring and interesting. When I listened to a few of his episodes, I definitely thought to myself, "wow, I wished I had access to these conversations while I was growing up." And even if you're not Asian but simply into culture and people, it's worth taking a listen to!
And don't forget to take a look at the Pen Pals Club information on the @dontbestrangers instagram page if you might be interested. It's also the page to go to if you want to show your support, leave some feedback, and/or apply to come on to co-host an episode! We can chat about anything you'd like and it's just a very chill conversation. Hope to keep in touch with you over instagram... and as always, don't be a stranger! Let's catch up again soon.